The narrative has always been that he was Joseph's closest friend and confidante and thus should have been aware of his brother's lies and deceptions. A forum for ex-mormons and others who have been affected by mormonism to get support and share news, commentary, and comedy about the Mormon church. Is our repentance process evidence of Mormons being more focused on works whereas to Evangelicals, grace is sufficient? If Newt were not running against one of us, and following directly if he didnt occasion a need to compare once again Evangelical mental states to our own (a cultural addiction), Im pretty sure we wouldnt think more than twice about Newt. One article even theorized that Newts serial adultery made him more relatable than Mitts one-woman for life approach. Sickening. At least thats what the linked newsstory says. See Section 132. They then merged with Stephen Covey back in the 90s. Theres no one else who can say what I can say. Hyrum W. Smith is a distinguished author, speaker, and businessman. In 1994, Gingrich responded to reports hed had extramarital affairs while running a family-values campaign in 1978 by saying: In the 1970s, things happened. Source: AP. Maybe. It doesnt matter what I live. Yet, if I compare our cultural views of repentance to a more stringent process such as corporeal mortification, practiced by only the most devout Catholics, I dont necessarily find that more empathetic or more admirable. See the Book of Abraham. I think he really does run according to what he perceives to be the will of the people (which, in the case of MA and [I believe] the US people as a whole, meant running [and ultimately governing] on a moderate platform). * He has served on several boards of directors and national advisory councils and has been the recipient of three honorary doctorate degrees. 4 Son of Joseph Smith Sr. and Lucy Mack. As a result of this decision, his wife of 32 years divorced him and he was excommunicated from the LDS Church. I also wanted to say Im with still confused on comment #1- in that my personal distaste for Newt Gingrich is unrelated to his extramarital affairs. They went on to raise six children and have 24 grandchildren. Thats why I wont vote for the ego-maniacal troll. (Photograph at Church History Library, Salt Lake City.) They had six children together. While on leave from the Army in 1966, Hyrum married Gail Cooper. And we, on the other side of the pond, cant bear it much longer. He participated in the standard Basic Training followed by Advanced Infantry Training (AIT), NCO Academy (Non-Commissioned Officer Academy) and Officer Candidate School (OCS) finishing as the Honor Graduate and top in his class in all four trainings. He delivered the first twenty-four pages of the printer's manuscript of the Book of Mormon to the E. B. Grandin office in mid-August 1829. While Evangelicals and Mormons both talk family-centric, Mormons add teeth to it. Ive known men, both in and out of the church, who have cheated on their wives. In your opinion, why do Mormons dislike Newt. I do consider that too in my own evaluation. Angie/Hawk (Im so confused! When his parents lost their home in Palmyra, Hyrum took them into his homehis father and mother and five siblings, ages seven to twenty-one, and Oliver Cowdery. If Newt wins, I am a vote for Obama by either staying home or putting in a write in (the more likely action). Smith used some of his fortune to buy a 22-acre ranch near St. George. Because we have enough. Anything earned beyond that, he said, was a stewardship that God has given me to do something with that matters.. So, from that one example and there was another similar situation that he was involved in that make me wonder about things. shelved 9,486 times Showing 30 distinct works. People who knew both of them say that Hyrum would occasionally chastise Joseph for joking around too much and being too informal and trusting people too easily. Funeral services will be held Tuesday, December 3, 2019 at 12:00 p.m. at the Ivins Stake Center, 260 East 1060 South, Ivins, Utah. He couldnt function well until it was fixed. As I examined my own Romney revulsion, I asked myself how I would feel if Romney were LDS? My reasoning for not liking Newt has nothing at all to do with his sex life. Hyrum Wayne Smith 1943 - 2019 . According to the interviewer "Unlike many of today's . I have seen it go both ways and I am not convinced that one is more prevalent than the other. Also, in case you're curious, he's revealed the 116 lost pages as well as the sealed portion of the book of Mormon. WTH doesnt even begin to describe my reaction to that one. I wish I knew how to understand and deal with Joseph Smiths actions and my own fathers multiple infidelities and adventures in sex crime. Newt, when asked how he could be unfaithful and give a speech on family values: It doesnt matter what I do. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Marysville, Ohio. Still Confused (31). The company sold its consumer products unit, which makes the Franklin Planner, to a private equity firm in 2008. In lieu of flowers please donate to the Hyrum & Gail Smith Tuacahn Legacy Endowment. Hyrum Wayne Smith, American management executive. I have lots of sympathy for the moral difficulties involved in keeping ones integrity through these brutal election processes. Express your condolences with flowers sent to Hyrum's family, Share your thoughts and memories of Hyrum, Share your thoughts and memories with family and friends of Hyrum, Funeral services will be held Tuesday, December 3, 2019 at 12:00 p.m. at the Ivins Stake Center, 260 East 1060 South, Ivins, Utah. The Salt Lake Tribune, Inc. is a 501(c)(3) public charity and contributions are tax Reading his process back to church membership filled me with empathy and admiration, knowing how difficult and humbling it must have been. Archived. One more thing on Romney, I may vote for him. 6. Smith returned to the fold that he had to make some real changes in his life. Mormons have a particular hatred for philandering husbands. I think Newt is a convenient sideshow. He was born Oct.16, 1943 . Open acceptance of his own hypocrisy? How many people make a profit off their adultery by writing a book about it? Though the spirits of all men who come to mortality overcame the enticements of Satan and his followers when they resided in the presence of God in their first estate . He loved riding his horses and spending time at his ranch, watching a good movie, visiting with friends, following current events, operating his blower to drive leaves and debris out of his garage and off his walks, eating good food (never without a napkin), and Sunday taco afternoons with children and grandchildren. Judging by the negativity of your post, I think its clear what kind of campaign youd run if you had $20million to spend to get yourself elected as the judgingist negativity detecting commenter evar. or at least to not like him for political reasons instead of his religion. I don't have a link, but I think those come from Wm. Smith was a close advisor and confidant to his brother Joseph as the latter produced the Book of Mormon and established the Church of Christ. Ida Smith, the great-great granddaughter of Hyrum Smith, who became convinced that Nemelka was called of God after reading The Sealed Portion, donated her plot to Nemelka. etc. The police have more experience in dealing with creeps like this and I would hope the Bishop takes his cue from them. Since Evangelicals believe the Bible to be inerrant and unalterable, theyre just left with: Judge not, lest ye be judged. So perhaps we do feel we are entitled to judge others if we believe our judgments are just. Joseph replied that "it was not expedient for him to tell more than had already been told about the coming forth of the Book of Mormon, and it was not well that any greater details be provided. He and Gail have been very generous to many other institutions and individuals about which they have chosen to remain anonymous. Quoted in Pearson H. Corbett, Hyrum SmithPatriarch (1963), 164. As to the link with polygamy, 80% of Mormons on the latest Pew survey considered polygamy a very serious sin, the worst one of those listed in the survey. northern state university softball roster. Cookie Notice Yes yes, theres the doctrine&covenants section where were told to vote for honest and wise leaders, but were not living in a theocracy where morality is the ultimate reason for choosing a president. Hyrum Smith the patriarch was never charged with or found guilty of adultery. Song. Too much psychological harm without any real payoff. Mitt might be a political opportunist to some degree, but at least I believe he sincerely wants to help and represent those he governs. He was born October 16, 1943 to Joseph Fielding and Ruth Pingree Smith in Salt Lake City, Utah. These questions have been discussed to death elsewhere on the Bloggernacle, and I dont want to derail the conversation, but I think the Sunday School judgmental attitude towards adultery, church history, and my family history make this all very complicated. That doesnt mean he wont be a good President. They see him as inauthentic and definitely NOT one of us especially when put up against very orthodox Romney. Im one of those independents who voted for Obama in 2008, and Im not thrilled with how that turned out. The flat out hypocrisy with which Romney spews out his paranoia of fear and violence speaks to an unstable and compartmentalized mind. His infidelity was not limited to his wives, and Ill not give him the chance to do it again. Good post, and a lot of interesting questions. -Hypocritical In my experience I dont think we are hard on adultery. His grandson, Joseph Fielding Smith also served as president of the church from 1970 to 1972. space bucket smell; sermon chosen for a purpose; norman gibson obituary; ri knights aau basketball; Mind TV. Great talk that explores suicide, excommunication, forgiveness, and the love of the Savior By Hyrum Smith (the Franklin Covey one) Close. Because of his prominence in the community, this confession cost him dearly, including being excommunicated from his church and financial losses to his business. Is Romney the right president for this time? Romney has annihilated him in every non-evangelical-dominated state thus far, and he knows the only shot he has is to rile up the bigotry and fear of enough people to cause the Santorum voters to switch to him and that, all by itself, is a truly frightening scenario. People need to hear what I have to say. Here is a compilation of what he had learned about it in his life. Get that minor non-salvific point outta here. I am curious about Brither Alvin. I immediately thought of a prominent LDS figure, Hyrum Smith who founded the Franklin company and was excommunicated for adultery. Thats the whole point of repentance. Metcalf Mortuary - St. George 288 West St. George Blvd. While Mitt as a dad who was never home probably resonates for many Mormons familiar with the number of hours high profile careers coupled with demanding church callings require, the idea of Newt as a kindly grandfather seemed completely out of left field to me as a Mormon. Well certainly not us Mormons, thats for sure. But the skank factor is way up at the top of my list. Joseph, Brigham, Heber, John Taylor, etc. Privacy Policy. Board member Great Salt Lake Council, Boy Scouts American, since 1982, Explorers, since 1982. He died of calomel poisoning aka mercury poisoning http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1070962/. I find him to be a loose cannon in the political realm. Grace is enough to the true evangelical because they will try to make things right regardless, on their own. 259K subscribers in the exmormon community. Smith was a direct descendant of Hyrum Smith, who died in 1844 alongside his brother, Mormon founder Joseph Smith, at the hands of an angry mob at the jail in Carthage, Ill. Proof of things long past using 19th century science looked to be impossible. He is very proud of what Tuacahn Center for the Arts has become. It doesnt necessarily mean the rest of the country sees it that way. I know plenty of Mormons who liked Newt although most of them came of age after Newts meltdown in the 90s. Hyrum traveled with his wife Gail all over the world for both business and pleasure. When a person who is truly repentant of what they did, they would not need any governing authority over them telling them that they need to repent or to then go reconcile their wrong doings. As a Mormon, the reason Joseph Smith is so important is because how I interpret his actions sets the tone for my fundamental understanding of morality, so it ties in to how I understand and deal with my father. Are Mormons culturally more critical of serious flaws in leaders than of others? Is it Newts relentless hypocrisy that disgusts Mormons? 8/10/2010. On 2 November 1826, in Manchester, New York, he married Jerusha Barden (18051837). The Axiom of Regularity, Theological Tag-alongs,Mormonism. What surprised me is how many of my non-LDS corporate colleagues are big Romney fans. As to other peoples adulteries and subsequent painful scenarios what happens in the labyrinth of bad relationships is often hidden from the participants themselves, let alone outside parties. Hyrum Andrus explains all of this very well, here is a link. This was very painful for the ex wife who had been wronged. By contrast, Evangelicals do not require baptism, accepting transfer baptism from other Protestant sects. As others in the comments have alluded, what bother me about Newt is his saying stuff like this: It doesnt matter what I do. As he pointed out, this kind of conversion is pretty easy. and is now a sealer in a Canadian Temple. he's been reincarnated and alive today in Salt Lake. . I hope were not all voting for who is more realistically flawed to represent us, I hope we are voting for the best leader to lead us. The evangelical does not need to be harder on ones sin as a Mormon. Theres no one else who can say what I can say. Underground polygamists 0, manifesto FTW. My first thought was that he probably would not be LDS any more, having been excommunicated, and it is unlikely he would have undergone the rigors of the process to become rebaptized. hyrum wayne smith excommunicated. -Despair Inducing Mercy cant rob justice. [4] When the Church of Christ was organized on April 6, 1830, six men signed their names as charter members; at the age of 30, Hyrum Smith was the oldest of the six. In tscc, when that shit happens you can rest assured that some great stuff has gone down the memory hole, and that the whitewash has been splashed about with great liberality. 2. Served on the equivalent of the school board, and town council, was very 'sober' and serious compared to Joseph Smith. Hyrum Smith (February 9, 1800 - June 27, 1844) was an American religious leader in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, the original church of the Latter Day Saint movement. Joe deservedly gets a great deal of attention for being a grade-A sleazeball, but what was Hyrum's role in all of this. Because of his position as Assistant President of the Church, it is likely that Smith would have succeeded Joseph and become the next president of the church had he outlived his brother. My dad is very tough on those who have committed adultery and have not sought forgiveness. He leaves behind his wife,. Do you think Mormons are tougher on adultery than other sects? The South Carolina primaries closed at 9:00 but Newts marraige will be open all night.. Do Evangelicals have a lot of philandering grandfathers and uncles? It ranks up there with his self-destructive open mike behavior. They do. Who am I to judge? All rights reserved. Part 10. I once took a religion class at BYU from Lloyd Newell (Music and the Spoken Word guy) on Teachings of the Living Prophets. His eldest son, John Smith, served as the church's Presiding Patriarch from 1855 to 1911. Mr. Smith was born Jan. 30, 1899, in Salt Lake City, a son of [Ida] Elizabeth Bowman and Hyrum Mack Smith. "Hyrum Smith to the Saints Scattered Abroad," Times and Seasons, Dec. 1839, 21. When polled, Iowa Republicans (sporting a strong Evangelical base) were asked how they viewed Newt and Mitt: A leading Democratic pollster, Peter Hart, recently conducted focus groups with Republican voters and made an astonishing discovery: voters, when asked which family member Newt most reminded them of, said their good uncle or their kindly grandfather. However, when asked who Mitt Romney most reminded them of, it was their Dad who was never home. I suppose you are right from that perspective. His books, seminars and presentations have been acclaimed by both American and international audiences. Press J to jump to the feed. He wrote several books, both on his business principles and his faith. Reading between the lines, there was a general fear of pregnancy of supposedly unmarried women who might be impregnated because of plural marriage arrangements. Learn how and when to remove this template message, Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Acting President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, "Moroni Appeared to 17 Different People! On this Wikipedia the language links are at the top of the page across from the article title. Hyrum is maybe the biggest the conundrum in the entire saga. He can do the crime, but not the time. I am not going to vote for Romney, but our country is in a better place if people like Romney or Huntsman are the GOP nominees. I would think more than twice about Newt in pretty much any election, simply because I loathe his candidacy so much. List Of Descendants Of Joseph Smith, Sr. And Lucy Mack Smith - Hyrum Smith. (Remember the old adage: If a man is cheating on his wife WITH you, he will cheat ON you.). Smith didn't anticipate the Rosetta stone. Hyrum W. Smith (October 16, 1943 - November 18, 2019) founded the Franklin Quest Company in 1983. I think our toughness on adultery leads to that kind of conclusion for many LDS. But that wouldnt bring out the collective Mormon hand-wringing weve seen, since most Mormons would be in danger of going over the cliff with the GOP. Blacks Didn't Sin in Pre-existence. It meant the world to him. So it was a. Being saved means accepting Christs atonement and your role as a sinner. Romney had to spend millions to get people not to trust a multiple adulterer whos sole campaign is best around his rhetorical barbs. For Mormons, the repentance process is very rigorous for adulterers. He also hated mess of any kind and always had on hand a generous supply of 409 spray bottles for any cleaning need that might come up. Books like Miracle of Forgiveness imply that returning to a sin after repentance undoes the original repentance, making the sin even more serious. Sure, he wasnt alone in this, but he was the leader. Not necessarily. 0. hyrum wayne smith excommunicated I think most Mormon Democrats (and I imagine that there are many who will cross party lines to vote for Romney) think Romney is definitely competent. he is perhaps best remembered for being killed with his brother Joseph Smith, Jr .Lovina Smith Walker born September 16, 1827 in Manchester, New York died October 8, 1876 in Farmington, Utah Territory Mary Smith born June 27, 1829 in Manchester, New York died May 29, 1832 in. How can an adulterer be called of God? taught about the need to receive the Baptism of Fire as part of our progression. It would be better to just work things out privately with the Bishop. Im a person who hasnt committed adultery twice when my spouse was gravely ill. And Im a Mormon. Narcissism? Newt is safely other and makes a reasonable scapegoat for a members frustration with lying, cheating, and hypocrisy. It was a big shock in the Provo area due to the respect people had for Smith as well as his being in leadership positions. ;-). At this stage the best hope for conservatives to get what they want is to get conservatives in the Senate and Congress who will direct Romney as President. The entire Smith household were set to profit if Joe's gold bible business took off. etc. I agree with the first part of your comment, Thomas, but I dont agree with the last part. Smith refused and, in 1844, traveled with Joseph to Carthage, Illinois, where both were charged with riot and treason. Smith died Monday in Gunlock, Utah, from cancer, according to an announcement Friday by FranklinCovey Co., the company he co-founded. The Smith Family would like to especially thank the many friends that came to visit, called on the phone, sent emails and cards and brought food in the last few months of Hyrums life. After staggering back, another ball fired through the window struck him in the back, passed through his body, and struck his watch in his vest pocket. Smith was a direct descendant of Hyrum Smith, who died in 1844 alongside his brother, Mormon founder Joseph Smith, at the hands of an angry mob at the jail in Carthage, Ill. #29 Yeah, Thomas, I can see that, unfortunately. I do think we are harder on adultery, but I think in Newts case its more the hypocrisy on top of repeat offenses. Hyrum was born in Tunbridge, Vermont, the second son of Joseph Smith Sr. and Lucy Mack Smith. While attempting to barricade the door to prevent the mob from entering, Smith was shot in the face on the left side of the nose.